15 replies to this topic

[Daedalus]

Just throwing this out there, because I see a lot of questions and a lot of wishy-washy answers about this...

• Your score in certain subjects is made up of components that are internally assessed and externally moderated
  
• Addition: some components, like your World Literature essay(s), ToK essay, and of course Extended Essay, are not moderated but assessed (i.e. all sent off) [thanks for lynyrd and imopotato for pointing out that the WL is not moderated]
  
• For others, like your IOC, Mathematics portfolios, Science Lab Reports, Economics Portfolio, (and so on), your teacher sends out a "representative" sample
  
• The size of this sample depends on the number of students in your class (imopotato cites the following; students in class : number of students' samples sent off: 5 or less : all | 6-20 : 5 | 21-41 : 8 | more than 41 : 10 |. This sounds reasonable to me.
  
• The sample consists of: the best score(s); the worst score(s); and the score(s) closest to the three quartiles (25%; 50%; 75%)... in other words a sample spread fairly accross the board
  
• The IB responds with a moderating curve, to adjust your teacher's scoring to the IB-school-wide standard This mechanism is not entirely easy to understand, but all you need to know is
  
• Sometimes all of the samples have been marked up, leading to a higher mark for all pieces handed in in the class
  
• Sometimes they are all marked down, leading to lower grades for everybody
  
• Sometimes (often, apparently) the top scores drop 1-2 marks, and the bottom ones gain 1-2 marks (imagine a sinuous sort of curve)

I can't really vouch for the technical accuracy of these statements, because my teachers gave them to me (semi-confidentially), but you can be almost certain that they are correct.

In terms of the implications ... the main one I guess is make sure you don't beg your teacher for marks, because you are putting an entire class' grades into jeopardy. An interesting side note is you can "cheat" in a sense and ensure your pieces of work aren't sent off for moderation, if you have a very obliging teacher. But I wouldn't recommend this; firstly because, as well all know from ToK, induction is not a reliable process (i.e. this could change for next year), and secondly, a teacher that obliging probably will cause the entire grade to be moderated down anyways.

One thing you can do is contact your IB Coordinator if you think your teacher is grading you poorly. Because if he is, and you're still doing top-notch work, your own score might suffer.

Anything to add or subtract from this is appreciated.

Update on external assessment. Turns out your IB Coordinator sends materials directly to the Examiners as told by IBO, who mark a large stack of papers and send a certain sample (following the same guidelines as above) to be remarked by another Examiner. It goes up in terms of seniority, in some way or another, so some papers end up being marked three times (the honour!) and some end up on the Chief Examiner's desk. The mechanism isn't entirely clear either but it seems to be quite close to a foolproof system, and you can also ask for a remark.

Edited by Daedalus, Jul 11, 2011 - 23:24.

[lynyrd]

I have a correction to your statement. Actually World Lits are part of the language A1 external assessment, and ALL world lit papers are sent to IB, not just a sample. check the A1 guide for further info!

[I`m Potato]

2.In other words, for your World Lit, IOC, Science Lab Reports, and so on, your teacher sends out a "representative" sample

These components are all externally assessed regardless of the number of students in the class.

• Extended essay
  
• Theory of knowledge essay
  
• Language A1 world literature
  
• Language A1 school supported self-taught oral examination audio recording
  
• Language A2 written task
  
• Music: Musical investigation
  
• Theatre practical performance proposals and research investigations

The rest are called internal assessments (these are marked by your teacher and examiners moderate their marks) such as science lab reports, mathematics portfolios etc.

3.The size of this sample depends on the number of students in your class (I think - this is the one point that needs confirming)

This is indeed true. However, to be more precise:

Students in a class:

• <= 5: all works
  
• 6-20: 5 candidates' works
  
• 21-40: 8 candidates' works
  
• >=41: 10 candidates' works

[laryxle]

I'm not sure that the one's chosen for moderation are the best, the worst, the median etc.; In my history class (9 people) my IA had the highest mark and was one of the 4 not chosen for moderation (i'm pretty sure the bottom mark wasn't chosen either). My teacher said she just entered the marks onto a computer and it chose 5, but i'm unsure of the process that they use to choose them.

[Matthew Sinclair]

Yeah it's not that the highest always get chosen for moderation from what I've gathered. In psych, the one with the highest wasn't chosen...the lowest was and a couple of near top ones and then some more lower ones. And I had the highest bio IA and I'm pretty sure I wasn't chosen. My guess is that they choose 'randomly' (computer or something) from each quartile. Like maybe a random one from each quartile and then one more from any depending on sample size or repeat that process??? Who knows

[Daedalus]

laryxle, on Nov 18, 2010 - 11:45, said:

I'm not sure that the one's chosen for moderation are the best, the worst, the median etc.; In my history class (9 people) my IA had the highest mark and was one of the 4 not chosen for moderation (i'm pretty sure the bottom mark wasn't chosen either). My teacher said she just entered the marks onto a computer and it chose 5, but i'm unsure of the process that they use to choose them.

Dunno about this. Some of my teachers have specifically told me that my IA will be chosen, because it is a certain mark. Maybe they're wrong then and the random-from-each-quartile-idea is correct?

[I`m Potato]

Our teachers just simply told us that a 'magic program' will randomly select names. Hmm.

[Miraine]

Might as well add that my math teacher told me he'd be sending the highest and lowest scoring math portfolios, as well as a few in-betweens.

I don't understand the reasoning behind number 9. How are the samples marked for that to happen?

Edited by Miraine, Dec 08, 2010 - 00:10.

[SmilingAtLife:)]

I`m Potato, on Nov 19, 2010 - 12:50, said:

Our teachers just simply told us that a 'magic program' will randomly select names. Hmm.

Same but they also said that if you got the highest or lowest, you will be chosen for sure.

Not like it matters, all my teachers said that grades have never been marked down or up at our school, ever, in all these years of IB.

[JoeGuff]

Yeah, I've heard that the teacher does not select whose work gets sent out, but IB or some other magician does.
I've asked various teachers this and they all say that teachers can't select who gets sent.

My IAs for Math and Psychology were sent out. I felt like crying both times lol, but they still had to send my IA's.

Edited by JoeGuff, Jul 07, 2011 - 23:43.

[charco]

There's seems to be some doubt as to the method used for selecting the IA samples for group 4. I can confirm that the IBO use an 'algorithm' to select the samples. However, it's pretty simple to see what it does.

The highest mark is selected (A marks)
The lowest mark is selected (Z marks)
The mark which is closest to (A + Z)/2 is chosen as the middle sample (M marks)
The remaining two samples are taken from the students that are closest to (A + M)/2 and (Z + M)/2

We use this to 'predict' which samples are going to be chosen and have never been wrong.

There is a chance for your teacher to flag students that he/she does not want to send. He is allowed to flag two 'atypical' candidates and ask for them not to form part of the sample. The IBO algorithm simply selects the student closest to the atypical one that it originally wanted.

In terms of what moderation does, they do produce a moderation curve, but it is not worldwide standardising; this would be impossible.

Many samples get slaughtered in group 4 IA and it is not unheard of for marks to be slashed by 50%. Every year a different moderator is assigned to each schools sample and gives feedback (although limited) as to why he has downgraded or upgraded marks.

However, as a different moderator has a different subjective approach, this feedback is essentially useless.

The same teacher providing the same samples two different years would likely be moderated in different ways. Of course this is impossible to prove as the students and their work are a variable every year.

But, essentially this should not matter as the teacher's judgement is beng moderated, not the student's content.

I can confirm that my moderation samples over ten years have varied from +2 for the highest student to -15, while ever trying to improve. This year my best student was downgraded 6 marks (44 - 38), while my lowest student was upgraded 2 marks.

Funny thing is, my highest student was an atypical candidate who did not even do the practical course with me - he arrived late from another school with portfolio already completed. How on earth could my moderation affect him????
Explain that one to me! (answers on a postcard, please)

[Desy Glau]

Loezie, on Aug 26, 2011 - 21:50, said:

Hi!!!

Today I got the breakdown of my exam results, and I was SHOCKED by how much three of my IA's were downgraded.

My physics HL IA got downgraded from 45 to 37 (18%)
My chemics SL IA got downgraded from 37 to 25 (32%)
My maths SL IA got downgraded from 38 to 29 (24%)

And the most frustrating thing of all is that (I'm pretty sure that) NONE of my IA's were sent away for moderation.

Does this mean that my teachers did a really lousy job assessing our IA's? Or are figures like these common?

How much did YOU get down/upgraded? Please tell me, I'm dying to hear 'cause I feel screwed. I trusted my teachers' evaluation throughout the course, but apparently they themselves don't know what they're doing.

Sorry if I sound a bit harsh, but this just suckz. :/

I've heard of this happening in some lousy international school. it's not just you. say your teacher sent X number of IAs to be moderated, if the moderator found out your teacher had marked those X people very leniently, then of course they downgrade the marks. say they downgrade those X people by N marks. then everyone in your class' IAs will also be downgraded by N.

I honestly won't complain. unless your IAs were so amazingly perfect you're surprised they're marked down. because some schools and teachers are just so bad that the students can't write good IAs and the teachers still give them good marks. wrong teaching, but this also happens in that lousy international school I mentioned. that school is famous for giving too high predictions to the students when the real IB total grade can go down by at least 5 until even 10 or more.

[Sinoco]

SmilingAtLife:), on May 03, 2011 - 18:39, said:

I`m Potato, on Nov 19, 2010 - 12:50, said:

Our teachers just simply told us that a 'magic program' will randomly select names. Hmm.

Same but they also said that if you got the highest or lowest, you will be chosen for sure.

Not like it matters, all my teachers said that grades have never been marked down or up at our school, ever, in all these years of IB.

Well, you must have some magical IB teachers then, as an IB teacher at my school told me that they were told to 'mark harder' because things kept getting marked down.

[Desy Glau]

Sinoco, on Oct 13, 2011 - 20:38, said:

SmilingAtLife:), on May 03, 2011 - 18:39, said:

Not like it matters, all my teachers said that grades have never been marked down or up at our school, ever, in all these years of IB.

Well, you must have some magical IB teachers then, as an IB teacher at my school told me that they were told to 'mark harder' because things kept getting marked down.

then your teachers are too lenient. at my school the grades usually stay the same or get marked up in some cases, because some of my teachers are really really strict! that's why I find it hard to bump up to a 7 sometimes, envying how easy it is for people at other schools to get awesome predictions.

[Sandwich]

This happened to my IB Chemistry coursework

I was on track for a 7, predicted a 7 in my coursework and in the exam and then after the final exams it turned out that I'd had my IAs remarked from a 7 back down to a 4. 3 whole grades! I wish I'd had a better Chemistry teacher who'd actually told me to go back and fix things rather than patting me on the back for what was apparently very bad work and giving me 7s so I never tried to change it or improve, thinking nothing was wrong. Grumble grumble grumble. Ended up getting a verryyy low 6 overall. At least it wasn't a 5 though.

Anyway, some of us just have teachers who have no idea what they're doing and mislead us or mark work really badly. Sadly not much you can do about it after it's happened to you e___e

On the plus side, my Spanish teacher who disliked me rather a lot and gave me low marks for my IAs had her stuff marked up. So I went from 5 --> 7 in that Very grateful mine got sent away for moderation on that one, ahah. I thought it was a pretty mean mark to be giving me even at the time