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I HATE TOK. its so pointless.


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  • 2 weeks later...

Man! I logged onto ibsurvival thinking how much I hate TOK and here's this post! Ha, I love it. The final draft of my essay is due on Tuesday. BLEEGHHH! >:P

Mine is tomorrow !!!!! :P

I hate the way ToK works, specially in schools or is it my teacher haha, but like the idea of it :P, I enjoy it until I get my marks :)

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Guest HwScuks

I found TOK very enjoyable when I first started, but now I realize how everything must fit into IB's little boxes; for example, the TOK textbook and documents strongly support the Sapir-Whorf hypothesis and the teachers are instructed to indoctrinate the classes with it, as it were, despite the fact that many modern scientists and epistemologists now overwhelmingly agree that although there is a point to the hypothesis that one's mother tongue can can shape one's perception of life, it is exaggerated and flawed to say that experience is completely defined by language, because it makes the assumption that people can't comprehend concepts that are absent from their languages.

I'm also annoyed by the use of terms which are exclusive to TOK, such as 'knowledge issue', which is defined by a worksheet as "questions that directly refer to our understanding of the world, ourselves and others, in connection with the acquisition, search for, production, shaping and acceptance of knowledge". (Correct me if I'm wrong, but the Richard van de Lagemaat TOK textbook neglects to define it at all, despite it being an important defining concept of the TOK presentation and essay and having criteria centered around it.) Yet, I've seen people get top marks for TOK presentations, focused on ethical or other issues, without once mentioning anything to do with how we know. It confuses me a bit, especially since my teacher forgot to teach my class about knowledge issues until he realized a while later that he hadn't.

Cool... That's really interesting.

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  • 4 weeks later...

Personally, TOK in my first year was awful, my teacher changed three times and whenever we actually managed to have a class, all I can remember is "but HOW do we know!?!?!"

WE DON'T. WE DON'T KNOW ANYTHING. OMG SHUTUP. :)

But see, the thing is, I actually like TOK. :) The concept. The thinking. The "philosophical" thinking. However, the reason I am not talking philosophy or anything as a subject (and therefore dislike TOK as a subject) is not just because my school doesn't offer it, but also because I hate the idea of being graded on my thinking!

I think the worst part about TOK, the part that makes it an annoying compulsory subject of sorts, is the way we are graded , the way examiners/teachers "measure" our "ability" to critically think the way TOK endorses. -_-

Also, it just sucks if you have a horrible teacher. Makes the whole program a billion times worse..

That's my 2c! :P

Edited by Ilkana
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  • 2 months later...
  • 3 weeks later...

I actually liked my TOK class because I loved the teacher. Idk if it was just our school, but our English teacher taught TOK as well. I thought it was really thought-provoking and we incorporated a lot of other subjects such as the oil crisis into it as well. But anyway, I'm probably biased because I did really well on my essay and my presentation. Whoooo! lol.

It seemed pointless at the beginning. Like I remember the first week of TOK. Our class had a discussion about if the chairs in the room moved since they weren't continually being watched. And even if they were, we could be deceived. I mean I sat there and was like this is gonna be a lonnnnnnnggggggggggg class lol.

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Even though my ToK teacher is nice, I find ToK soooo annoying! A lot of the times I feel as if it's just there to make IB look really exclusive and pish-posh. Sometimes I feel like it's just a waste of time, and wish I could dedicate the time I put into it towards other subjects.

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One of the trends you will find with regard to ToK is that most students approach the subject with a negative attitude even before the course has started. The first few cohorts of students to do the IB will generally despise ToK mainly due to the lack of resources, teachers with little experience and a general lack of understanding of the subject. Students who do poorly in ToK tend to make more noise than those who do well. The effects of this is that future cohorts generalise from these incidences and what they hear from their elder peers and form a natural reluctance to study the subject. I feel that it does the subject injustice to approach it with a biased mind.

Another trend you will find in most schools is the segregation of ToK with normal subjects. The level of this segregation is to the extent that barely any ToK is discussed in normal lessons. It is advised that subject teachers merge some form of ToK education into their normal subject but you will find most teachers do not do this or they dedicate the introductory lesson of the subject (the very first lesson) to this task and never touch on ToK again. In my opinion, ToK is feared by teachers as much as students because they have no past experience of teaching such a subject which differs greatly both in content and style from their original subjects. This phobia is naturally passed onto students which adds onto the student’s subconscious dislike of the subject as they deem it useless and pointless. If 10 minutes was used at the end of every subject lesson to recap the aims of the lesson and to introduce a bit of ToK, I believe that students can form a better understanding of ToK and draw more connections to it. Any subject can be labeled a ‘bull****’ subject; history, philosophy, geography, music, psychology… the list is endless. What subject doesn’t explore ideas?

Of course, you can say that the subject is a waste of your time and there is no point in studying it and I do agree that the IB sometimes uses ToK as an advertisement banner. However, does it not seem logical that one must be aware of the nature of what they are being taught? It is simply an evaluative mechanism similar to what you do in the CE of your science IAs or evaluation of economic concepts. I see no harm in it. Education is like going into a shop and buying a product, ToK is like asking how useful that product is. Wouldn’t you want to know the limitations of your education? If your answer is no, then I don’t see the point in you receiving education at all because you don’t seem to value it. On the other hand, if you are purely receiving education so that you can get into the LSE, get a job at the Goldman Sachs and you just so happen to be doing the IB; well I don’t think I need to convince you any further about paying attention in your ToK lessons.

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  • 2 weeks later...

To some extent, I agree it is pointless. However, some class discussions tend to get interesting while some get reaalllllly realllly boring with useless "claims". Whoever said its for advertisement purposes, u are reading my mind!!!

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One of the trends you will find with regard to ToK is that most students approach the subject with a negative attitude even before the course has started. The first few cohorts of students to do the IB will generally despise ToK mainly due to the lack of resources, teachers with little experience and a general lack of understanding of the subject. Students who do poorly in ToK tend to make more noise than those who do well. The effects of this is that future cohorts generalise from these incidences and what they hear from their elder peers and form a natural reluctance to study the subject. I feel that it does the subject injustice to approach it with a biased mind.

Another trend you will find in most schools is the segregation of ToK with normal subjects. The level of this segregation is to the extent that barely any ToK is discussed in normal lessons. It is advised that subject teachers merge some form of ToK education into their normal subject but you will find most teachers do not do this or they dedicate the introductory lesson of the subject (the very first lesson) to this task and never touch on ToK again. In my opinion, ToK is feared by teachers as much as students because they have no past experience of teaching such a subject which differs greatly both in content and style from their original subjects. This phobia is naturally passed onto students which adds onto the student’s subconscious dislike of the subject as they deem it useless and pointless. If 10 minutes was used at the end of every subject lesson to recap the aims of the lesson and to introduce a bit of ToK, I believe that students can form a better understanding of ToK and draw more connections to it. Any subject can be labeled a ‘bull****’ subject; history, philosophy, geography, music, psychology… the list is endless. What subject doesn’t explore ideas?

Of course, you can say that the subject is a waste of your time and there is no point in studying it and I do agree that the IB sometimes uses ToK as an advertisement banner. However, does it not seem logical that one must be aware of the nature of what they are being taught? It is simply an evaluative mechanism similar to what you do in the CE of your science IAs or evaluation of economic concepts. I see no harm in it. Education is like going into a shop and buying a product, ToK is like asking how useful that product is. Wouldn’t you want to know the limitations of your education? If your answer is no, then I don’t see the point in you receiving education at all because you don’t seem to value it. On the other hand, if you are purely receiving education so that you can get into the LSE, get a job at the Goldman Sachs and you just so happen to be doing the IB; well I don’t think I need to convince you any further about paying attention in your ToK lessons.

Hehehehe! Too funny! :rofl:

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One of the trends you will find with regard to ToK is that most students approach the subject with a negative attitude even before the course has started. The first few cohorts of students to do the IB will generally despise ToK mainly due to the lack of resources, teachers with little experience and a general lack of understanding of the subject. Students who do poorly in ToK tend to make more noise than those who do well. The effects of this is that future cohorts generalise from these incidences and what they hear from their elder peers and form a natural reluctance to study the subject. I feel that it does the subject injustice to approach it with a biased mind.

Another trend you will find in most schools is the segregation of ToK with normal subjects. The level of this segregation is to the extent that barely any ToK is discussed in normal lessons. It is advised that subject teachers merge some form of ToK education into their normal subject but you will find most teachers do not do this or they dedicate the introductory lesson of the subject (the very first lesson) to this task and never touch on ToK again. In my opinion, ToK is feared by teachers as much as students because they have no past experience of teaching such a subject which differs greatly both in content and style from their original subjects. This phobia is naturally passed onto students which adds onto the student’s subconscious dislike of the subject as they deem it useless and pointless. If 10 minutes was used at the end of every subject lesson to recap the aims of the lesson and to introduce a bit of ToK, I believe that students can form a better understanding of ToK and draw more connections to it. Any subject can be labeled a ‘bull****’ subject; history, philosophy, geography, music, psychology… the list is endless. What subject doesn’t explore ideas?

Of course, you can say that the subject is a waste of your time and there is no point in studying it and I do agree that the IB sometimes uses ToK as an advertisement banner. However, does it not seem logical that one must be aware of the nature of what they are being taught? It is simply an evaluative mechanism similar to what you do in the CE of your science IAs or evaluation of economic concepts. I see no harm in it. Education is like going into a shop and buying a product, ToK is like asking how useful that product is. Wouldn’t you want to know the limitations of your education? If your answer is no, then I don’t see the point in you receiving education at all because you don’t seem to value it. On the other hand, if you are purely receiving education so that you can get into the LSE, get a job at the Goldman Sachs and you just so happen to be doing the IB; well I don’t think I need to convince you any further about paying attention in your ToK lessons.

Hehehehe! Too funny! :rofl:

It wasn't meant to be funny.

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One of the trends you will find with regard to ToK is that most students approach the subject with a negative attitude even before the course has started. The first few cohorts of students to do the IB will generally despise ToK mainly due to the lack of resources, teachers with little experience and a general lack of understanding of the subject. Students who do poorly in ToK tend to make more noise than those who do well. The effects of this is that future cohorts generalise from these incidences and what they hear from their elder peers and form a natural reluctance to study the subject. I feel that it does the subject injustice to approach it with a biased mind.

Another trend you will find in most schools is the segregation of ToK with normal subjects. The level of this segregation is to the extent that barely any ToK is discussed in normal lessons. It is advised that subject teachers merge some form of ToK education into their normal subject but you will find most teachers do not do this or they dedicate the introductory lesson of the subject (the very first lesson) to this task and never touch on ToK again. In my opinion, ToK is feared by teachers as much as students because they have no past experience of teaching such a subject which differs greatly both in content and style from their original subjects. This phobia is naturally passed onto students which adds onto the student’s subconscious dislike of the subject as they deem it useless and pointless. If 10 minutes was used at the end of every subject lesson to recap the aims of the lesson and to introduce a bit of ToK, I believe that students can form a better understanding of ToK and draw more connections to it. Any subject can be labeled a ‘bull****’ subject; history, philosophy, geography, music, psychology… the list is endless. What subject doesn’t explore ideas?

Of course, you can say that the subject is a waste of your time and there is no point in studying it and I do agree that the IB sometimes uses ToK as an advertisement banner. However, does it not seem logical that one must be aware of the nature of what they are being taught? It is simply an evaluative mechanism similar to what you do in the CE of your science IAs or evaluation of economic concepts. I see no harm in it. Education is like going into a shop and buying a product, ToK is like asking how useful that product is. Wouldn’t you want to know the limitations of your education? If your answer is no, then I don’t see the point in you receiving education at all because you don’t seem to value it. On the other hand, if you are purely receiving education so that you can get into the LSE, get a job at the Goldman Sachs and you just so happen to be doing the IB; well I don’t think I need to convince you any further about paying attention in your ToK lessons.

Hehehehe! Too funny! :rofl:

It wasn't meant to be funny.

I know...but in the context of the thread, in which the idea is how much someone hates ToK, you come up with an almost ToK like response. It's a good response though, I'm not at all criticising you.

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  • 1 month later...

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