15-year-old has SECOND child! - What to do?

[susanne]

1). while many people are bashing the youths today for all the shiz that we do, and generalize us as a bunch of "good-for-nothing" people, I think it is important t step back and look at who we really are. Yes some of us may be like that, but the rest of us are not. I attend a public school, and public schools are usually depicted as a "laid back place where kids learn nothing"; however, it has never been like that, at all. Most of us are hardworking people who strives to do our best; club leaders, prefects, good students are NOT a minority, but majority rather. I know a girl who has went out with this guy in my class from yr 8 all the way to now, and they never have exhibited the slightest hint of what this girl has done. Futhermore, linking back to the hippie's time, how do you know what we are doing are wrong? and how do we know that what the older generation believes in is absolutely right, just because it might be a majority thing?

2) personally, I am massively against the large paycheques the government give her. It is the same principle as how the kardashian got their moneys. I agree with arrowhead that the money could be used better elsewhere (I don't live in the UK though)

and bam, rant over

[Aegle]

My views are...

1) What is happening to youth? Well they are just getting bolder and bolder day by day ignoring the consequences and they are very weak minded ( can't control their desires). Well parents are becoming more and more liberal and many schools don't have Personality Development Classes. In a typical local school that I have observes ruffians are respected and they have huge friend circle whereas people who are very good ( having respect for all people and is aware of all the moral values ) are just blacklisted ! Completely opposite to what I read in novels and story books wherein the good people are very popular and the bad people are completely rejected in the society. Also nowadays I think that youth are constantly exposed to bad things and bad companies and that is why most of the youths are today might be intelligent but morally devoid.

2) My tax money to look after them? I would rather be happy if the government put them in jail especially boy. Even the girl must be punished because she was not forced into this and even her mother must go to jail for not inculcating moral values in her. I, as an economic student have some different theory. The government must confiscate all the property of both that boy and girl ( if the girl is raped, the govt must confiscate the property of boy and give it to the girl.). Then you will all see how these sort of stupidity will vanish from this earth.

Firstly, a single example of a girl becoming pregnant is not sufficient enough to support the idea youth are becoming "weak-minded". Not all teenagers become pregnant, and pregnancy and childbirth may be the result of a lack of sexual education or the failure of birth control measures. Birth control can fail for adults as well. Furthermore, how do you decide what moral values are best, and what types of people are "morally devoid"? In the past, 15 year olds did marry and have children as this was socially acceptable. I do not understand what you mean by "Personality Development Classes", but I have never attended a class specifically targeted towards developing my personality. I do not, however, think that I can be classified as a "morally devoid" person.

Secondly, childbirth is not a crime, and sending young children or adolescents to jail for pregnancy is not beneficial to society as it leaves their infant children without a healthy environment in which to grow up in (and children should not be given up for adoption without their parents' consent--see Australia in the 20th century) and is unlikely to cause "stupidity..[to] vanish from this earth".

You argue that the girl in this situation should be sent to jail "because she was not forced". Even if sending teen (or tween) parents to jail was legal, sending people with an exception for rape creates a situation where rape victims can be sent to jail unless they are willing to reveal that they have been raped and can prove that they were raped.

[Matsu]

LOL come on 15 year old kid, at least use protection...

My views are that this kid was a freaking moron, but I don't think anyone has the right to chastise the youth as a whole for the stupid decisions of a few kids. In any case, people have been having sex at a young age since.. .well forever (that's kind of why we survived as a species). It's not exactly a new thing.

[Matsu]

1). while many people are bashing the youths today for all the shiz that we do, and generalize us as a bunch of "good-for-nothing" people, I think it is important t step back and look at who we really are. Yes some of us may be like that, but the rest of us are not. I attend a public school, and public schools are usually depicted as a "laid back place where kids learn nothing"; however, it has never been like that, at all. Most of us are hardworking people who strives to do our best; club leaders, prefects, good students are NOT a minority, but majority rather. I know a girl who has went out with this guy in my class from yr 8 all the way to now, and they never have exhibited the slightest hint of what this girl has done. Futhermore, linking back to the hippie's time, how do you know what we are doing are wrong? and how do we know that what the older generation believes in is absolutely right, just because it might be a majority thing?

2) personally, I am massively against the large paycheques the government give her. It is the same principle as how the kardashian got their moneys. I agree with arrowhead that the money could be used better elsewhere (I don't live in the UK though)

and bam, rant over

Number 1, I completely agree with, number 2, I can see your point, but I think it's good to know that the government (well at least if you live in the UK.. which I don't) has your back if you screw up, which is the way it should be. You can't always be expected to live your life like a beast, and at least we have ways to structurally mitigate the harm that comes from your life being in the metaphorical sh*tter.

[Black Bird Lockheed]

My views are...

1) What is happening to youth? Well they are just getting bolder and bolder day by day ignoring the consequences and they are very weak minded ( can't control their desires). Well parents are becoming more and more liberal and many schools don't have Personality Development Classes. In a typical local school that I have observes ruffians are respected and they have huge friend circle whereas people who are very good ( having respect for all people and is aware of all the moral values ) are just blacklisted ! Completely opposite to what I read in novels and story books wherein the good people are very popular and the bad people are completely rejected in the society. Also nowadays I think that youth are constantly exposed to bad things and bad companies and that is why most of the youths are today might be intelligent but morally devoid.

2) My tax money to look after them? I would rather be happy if the government put them in jail especially boy. Even the girl must be punished because she was not forced into this and even her mother must go to jail for not inculcating moral values in her. I, as an economic student have some different theory. The government must confiscate all the property of both that boy and girl ( if the girl is raped, the govt must confiscate the property of boy and give it to the girl.). Then you will all see how these sort of stupidity will vanish from this earth.

Firstly, a single example of a girl becoming pregnant is not sufficient enough to support the idea youth are becoming "weak-minded". Not all teenagers become pregnant, and pregnancy and childbirth may be the result of a lack of sexual education or the failure of birth control measures. Birth control can fail for adults as well. Furthermore, how do you decide what moral values are best, and what types of people are "morally devoid"? In the past, 15 year olds did marry and have children as this was socially acceptable. I do not understand what you mean by "Personality Development Classes", but I have never attended a class specifically targeted towards developing my personality. I do not, however, think that I can be classified as a "morally devoid" person.

Secondly, childbirth is not a crime, and sending young children or adolescents to jail for pregnancy is not beneficial to society as it leaves their infant children without a healthy environment in which to grow up in (and children should not be given up for adoption without their parents' consent--see Australia in the 20th century) and is unlikely to cause "stupidity..[to] vanish from this earth".

You argue that the girl in this situation should be sent to jail "because she was not forced". Even if sending teen (or tween) parents to jail was legal, sending people with an exception for rape creates a situation where rape victims can be sent to jail unless they are willing to reveal that they have been raped and can prove that they were raped.

So, do you think having illegitimate child is ethical?

[susanne]

sorry if I'm messing my points up again;

I do support government helping teen moms, but I am against LARGE paycheques. then it practically sounds like they are unwittingly exploiting the mom.

1). while many people are bashing the youths today for all the shiz that we do, and generalize us as a bunch of "good-for-nothing" people, I think it is important t step back and look at who we really are. Yes some of us may be like that, but the rest of us are not. I attend a public school, and public schools are usually depicted as a "laid back place where kids learn nothing"; however, it has never been like that, at all. Most of us are hardworking people who strives to do our best; club leaders, prefects, good students are NOT a minority, but majority rather. I know a girl who has went out with this guy in my class from yr 8 all the way to now, and they never have exhibited the slightest hint of what this girl has done. Futhermore, linking back to the hippie's time, how do you know what we are doing are wrong? and how do we know that what the older generation believes in is absolutely right, just because it might be a majority thing?

2) personally, I am massively against the large paycheques the government give her. It is the same principle as how the kardashian got their moneys. I agree with arrowhead that the money could be used better elsewhere (I don't live in the UK though)

and bam, rant over

Number 1, I completely agree with, number 2, I can see your point, but I think it's good to know that the government (well at least if you live in the UK.. which I don't) has your back if you screw up, which is the way it should be. You can't always be expected to live your life like a beast, and at least we have ways to structurally mitigate the harm that comes from your life being in the metaphorical sh*tter.

[susanne]

My views are...

1) What is happening to youth? Well they are just getting bolder and bolder day by day ignoring the consequences and they are very weak minded ( can't control their desires). Well parents are becoming more and more liberal and many schools don't have Personality Development Classes. In a typical local school that I have observes ruffians are respected and they have huge friend circle whereas people who are very good ( having respect for all people and is aware of all the moral values ) are just blacklisted ! Completely opposite to what I read in novels and story books wherein the good people are very popular and the bad people are completely rejected in the society. Also nowadays I think that youth are constantly exposed to bad things and bad companies and that is why most of the youths are today might be intelligent but morally devoid.

2) My tax money to look after them? I would rather be happy if the government put them in jail especially boy. Even the girl must be punished because she was not forced into this and even her mother must go to jail for not inculcating moral values in her. I, as an economic student have some different theory. The government must confiscate all the property of both that boy and girl ( if the girl is raped, the govt must confiscate the property of boy and give it to the girl.). Then you will all see how these sort of stupidity will vanish from this earth.

Firstly, a single example of a girl becoming pregnant is not sufficient enough to support the idea youth are becoming "weak-minded". Not all teenagers become pregnant, and pregnancy and childbirth may be the result of a lack of sexual education or the failure of birth control measures. Birth control can fail for adults as well. Furthermore, how do you decide what moral values are best, and what types of people are "morally devoid"? In the past, 15 year olds did marry and have children as this was socially acceptable. I do not understand what you mean by "Personality Development Classes", but I have never attended a class specifically targeted towards developing my personality. I do not, however, think that I can be classified as a "morally devoid" person.

Secondly, childbirth is not a crime, and sending young children or adolescents to jail for pregnancy is not beneficial to society as it leaves their infant children without a healthy environment in which to grow up in (and children should not be given up for adoption without their parents' consent--see Australia in the 20th century) and is unlikely to cause "stupidity..[to] vanish from this earth".

You argue that the girl in this situation should be sent to jail "because she was not forced". Even if sending teen (or tween) parents to jail was legal, sending people with an exception for rape creates a situation where rape victims can be sent to jail unless they are willing to reveal that they have been raped and can prove that they were raped.

So, do you think having illegitimate child is ethical?

can you define ethical here?

[Black Bird Lockheed]

My views are...

1) What is happening to youth? Well they are just getting bolder and bolder day by day ignoring the consequences and they are very weak minded ( can't control their desires). Well parents are becoming more and more liberal and many schools don't have Personality Development Classes. In a typical local school that I have observes ruffians are respected and they have huge friend circle whereas people who are very good ( having respect for all people and is aware of all the moral values ) are just blacklisted ! Completely opposite to what I read in novels and story books wherein the good people are very popular and the bad people are completely rejected in the society. Also nowadays I think that youth are constantly exposed to bad things and bad companies and that is why most of the youths are today might be intelligent but morally devoid.

2) My tax money to look after them? I would rather be happy if the government put them in jail especially boy. Even the girl must be punished because she was not forced into this and even her mother must go to jail for not inculcating moral values in her. I, as an economic student have some different theory. The government must confiscate all the property of both that boy and girl ( if the girl is raped, the govt must confiscate the property of boy and give it to the girl.). Then you will all see how these sort of stupidity will vanish from this earth.

Firstly, a single example of a girl becoming pregnant is not sufficient enough to support the idea youth are becoming "weak-minded". Not all teenagers become pregnant, and pregnancy and childbirth may be the result of a lack of sexual education or the failure of birth control measures. Birth control can fail for adults as well. Furthermore, how do you decide what moral values are best, and what types of people are "morally devoid"? In the past, 15 year olds did marry and have children as this was socially acceptable. I do not understand what you mean by "Personality Development Classes", but I have never attended a class specifically targeted towards developing my personality. I do not, however, think that I can be classified as a "morally devoid" person.

Secondly, childbirth is not a crime, and sending young children or adolescents to jail for pregnancy is not beneficial to society as it leaves their infant children without a healthy environment in which to grow up in (and children should not be given up for adoption without their parents' consent--see Australia in the 20th century) and is unlikely to cause "stupidity..[to] vanish from this earth".

You argue that the girl in this situation should be sent to jail "because she was not forced". Even if sending teen (or tween) parents to jail was legal, sending people with an exception for rape creates a situation where rape victims can be sent to jail unless they are willing to reveal that they have been raped and can prove that they were raped.

So, do you think having illegitimate child is ethical?

can you define ethical here?

Ethical I meant to say is that is it appropriate to have a illegitimate child?. So ok considering that the girl is innocent, who will you blame? The boy or her mother.

[Arrowhead]

Ethical I meant to say is that is it appropriate to have a illegitimate child?. So ok considering that the girl is innocent, who will you blame? The boy or her mother.

I would blame everyone. But that has nothing to do with anything. My personal reservations about each party involved has nothing to do with this problem. Taxpayer money being thrown to solve it, that is the issue.

Having a child when you're a teenager (or not even a teenager then) is unfortunate, but the child is not "illegitimate." At least not in western liberal society.

[Luka Petrovic]

My views are...

1) What is happening to youth? Well they are just getting bolder and bolder day by day ignoring the consequences and they are very weak minded ( can't control their desires). Well parents are becoming more and more liberal and many schools don't have Personality Development Classes. In a typical local school that I have observes ruffians are respected and they have huge friend circle whereas people who are very good ( having respect for all people and is aware of all the moral values ) are just blacklisted ! Completely opposite to what I read in novels and story books wherein the good people are very popular and the bad people are completely rejected in the society. Also nowadays I think that youth are constantly exposed to bad things and bad companies and that is why most of the youths are today might be intelligent but morally devoid.

2) My tax money to look after them? I would rather be happy if the government put them in jail especially boy. Even the girl must be punished because she was not forced into this and even her mother must go to jail for not inculcating moral values in her. I, as an economic student have some different theory. The government must confiscate all the property of both that boy and girl ( if the girl is raped, the govt must confiscate the property of boy and give it to the girl.). Then you will all see how these sort of stupidity will vanish from this earth.

Firstly, a single example of a girl becoming pregnant is not sufficient enough to support the idea youth are becoming "weak-minded". Not all teenagers become pregnant, and pregnancy and childbirth may be the result of a lack of sexual education or the failure of birth control measures. Birth control can fail for adults as well. Furthermore, how do you decide what moral values are best, and what types of people are "morally devoid"? In the past, 15 year olds did marry and have children as this was socially acceptable. I do not understand what you mean by "Personality Development Classes", but I have never attended a class specifically targeted towards developing my personality. I do not, however, think that I can be classified as a "morally devoid" person.

the fact that 15 year olds used to get married is irrelevant. Age doesn't matter, its the maturity society expects from someone their age and their means. Once upon a time a child was considered to behave like an adult after around age 12 (around the age of communion or bar- mitzvahs). So having a child at 15 didn't matter that they were 15 but that they acted and operated like an adult. now a days we are still kids until 30 years of age practically so yes, having a child at 15 is very very young by our standards. As well you will see below what I mean by someone having the "means' to have a child and what is ethical what is not (historically speaking, somewhat holds true today)

Not looking from a religious stand point, the reason why religions have the law of not having sex before marriage actually makes alot of sense. marriage isn't so much a license to spend the rest of your life with someone and love them and share property 9historically speaking) it was a license to have kids. before birth control and other assorted contraceptive goodies having extra kids around was not good, you would be come a burden on your family, the child would suffer in poorer conditions. So since most couples come marriage were relatively self-sustaining they were ready to have a child. So yes back then it was some what unethical to have a child outside of wed-lock. Even today that somewhat holds true, but I know I will get shredded for saying that...

Edited May 9, 2013 by Luka Petrovic

[Luka Petrovic]

Ethical I meant to say is that is it appropriate to have a illegitimate child?. So ok considering that the girl is innocent, who will you blame? The boy or her mother.

I would blame everyone. But that has nothing to do with anything. My personal reservations about each party involved has nothing to do with this problem. Taxpayer money being thrown to solve it, that is the issue.

Having a child when you're a teenager (or not even a teenager then) is unfortunate, but the child is not "illegitimate." At least not in western liberal society.

Then what do you suggest for the government to do? its obvious that an intervention is needed to lessen the risk of a repeat the following generation. Something has to be done so the kid doesn't do the same as there parents did. Or atleast deters them from that choice

[Arrowhead]

Then what do you suggest for the government to do? its obvious that an intervention is needed to lessen the risk of a repeat the following generation. Something has to be done so the kid doesn't do the same as there parents did. Or atleast deters them from that choice

You see, I would love nothing more than fo the government to intervene to "deter them from that choice" and to prevent "a repeat the following generation." But that is not happening. Teenagers continually get pregnant anyway.

The government is not doing anything useful in this context. They are throwing money at the problem. Free housing. Benefits. You name it.

As I have said in earlier posts on this thread: where is the counselling? Where are the self-esteem classes? Where is the individual and group therapy?

Some may argue that these options are available to those who wish to seek it, but that is my issue: why are these things an option? Why are they not mandatory stipulations to receiving aid from the government?

Don't want to attend therapy? Don't want to learn to ensure a repeat performance does not occur - fine! You get no money from the government! This doesn't happen though.

Now we just have a group of dysfunctional teenagers from dysfunctional families, creating more dysfunctional families, and the government's solution, pure and simple: let's throw money at it.

[Luka Petrovic]

I agree money isn't the solution, the problem is society and community. A weak poor community will result in a poor population. We think money and government spending is the problem, but its not its the lack of a good community from which come good examples and role models. if you can't get if from your nuclear family, then its from your immediate family, grandfather or uncle as father figure instead of father, then it comes from larger communities, school, sports, clubs, religious communities. if you are missing one, another community will likely pick up the slack and you will turn out okay. That being said for a lot of people, this whole chain of communities is broken, and that is a bad situation for social mammals like us!

[Aegle]

My views are...

1) What is happening to youth? Well they are just getting bolder and bolder day by day ignoring the consequences and they are very weak minded ( can't control their desires). Well parents are becoming more and more liberal and many schools don't have Personality Development Classes. In a typical local school that I have observes ruffians are respected and they have huge friend circle whereas people who are very good ( having respect for all people and is aware of all the moral values ) are just blacklisted ! Completely opposite to what I read in novels and story books wherein the good people are very popular and the bad people are completely rejected in the society. Also nowadays I think that youth are constantly exposed to bad things and bad companies and that is why most of the youths are today might be intelligent but morally devoid.

2) My tax money to look after them? I would rather be happy if the government put them in jail especially boy. Even the girl must be punished because she was not forced into this and even her mother must go to jail for not inculcating moral values in her. I, as an economic student have some different theory. The government must confiscate all the property of both that boy and girl ( if the girl is raped, the govt must confiscate the property of boy and give it to the girl.). Then you will all see how these sort of stupidity will vanish from this earth.

Firstly, a single example of a girl becoming pregnant is not sufficient enough to support the idea youth are becoming "weak-minded". Not all teenagers become pregnant, and pregnancy and childbirth may be the result of a lack of sexual education or the failure of birth control measures. Birth control can fail for adults as well. Furthermore, how do you decide what moral values are best, and what types of people are "morally devoid"? In the past, 15 year olds did marry and have children as this was socially acceptable. I do not understand what you mean by "Personality Development Classes", but I have never attended a class specifically targeted towards developing my personality. I do not, however, think that I can be classified as a "morally devoid" person.

Secondly, childbirth is not a crime, and sending young children or adolescents to jail for pregnancy is not beneficial to society as it leaves their infant children without a healthy environment in which to grow up in (and children should not be given up for adoption without their parents' consent--see Australia in the 20th century) and is unlikely to cause "stupidity..[to] vanish from this earth".

You argue that the girl in this situation should be sent to jail "because she was not forced". Even if sending teen (or tween) parents to jail was legal, sending people with an exception for rape creates a situation where rape victims can be sent to jail unless they are willing to reveal that they have been raped and can prove that they were raped.

So, do you think having illegitimate child is ethical?

I believe that, in a modern western society, all children are legitimate children.

I'm not quite sure what you mean by "ethical" in your question. Could you please clarify this for me? Thanks.

[Aegle]

My views are...

1) What is happening to youth? Well they are just getting bolder and bolder day by day ignoring the consequences and they are very weak minded ( can't control their desires). Well parents are becoming more and more liberal and many schools don't have Personality Development Classes. In a typical local school that I have observes ruffians are respected and they have huge friend circle whereas people who are very good ( having respect for all people and is aware of all the moral values ) are just blacklisted ! Completely opposite to what I read in novels and story books wherein the good people are very popular and the bad people are completely rejected in the society. Also nowadays I think that youth are constantly exposed to bad things and bad companies and that is why most of the youths are today might be intelligent but morally devoid.

2) My tax money to look after them? I would rather be happy if the government put them in jail especially boy. Even the girl must be punished because she was not forced into this and even her mother must go to jail for not inculcating moral values in her. I, as an economic student have some different theory. The government must confiscate all the property of both that boy and girl ( if the girl is raped, the govt must confiscate the property of boy and give it to the girl.). Then you will all see how these sort of stupidity will vanish from this earth.

Firstly, a single example of a girl becoming pregnant is not sufficient enough to support the idea youth are becoming "weak-minded". Not all teenagers become pregnant, and pregnancy and childbirth may be the result of a lack of sexual education or the failure of birth control measures. Birth control can fail for adults as well. Furthermore, how do you decide what moral values are best, and what types of people are "morally devoid"? In the past, 15 year olds did marry and have children as this was socially acceptable. I do not understand what you mean by "Personality Development Classes", but I have never attended a class specifically targeted towards developing my personality. I do not, however, think that I can be classified as a "morally devoid" person.

Secondly, childbirth is not a crime, and sending young children or adolescents to jail for pregnancy is not beneficial to society as it leaves their infant children without a healthy environment in which to grow up in (and children should not be given up for adoption without their parents' consent--see Australia in the 20th century) and is unlikely to cause "stupidity..[to] vanish from this earth".

You argue that the girl in this situation should be sent to jail "because she was not forced". Even if sending teen (or tween) parents to jail was legal, sending people with an exception for rape creates a situation where rape victims can be sent to jail unless they are willing to reveal that they have been raped and can prove that they were raped.

So, do you think having illegitimate child is ethical?

can you define ethical here?

Ethical I meant to say is that is it appropriate to have a illegitimate child?. So ok considering that the girl is innocent, who will you blame? The boy or her mother.

Oh, I just saw this reply!^ Awkward.

Well, I don't think whether something is appropriate or not is the same thing as whether something is right or wrong.

Still not quite sure what you mean by illegitimate (as in an actually illegal existence--ie. being "illegal" due to some sort of law such as China's one-child policy--or as in non-married parents?). I think that, for most people, it is definitely 'appropriate' to have children.

Assuming that you are referring to the fifteen year old girl with the two children, I think that having children at such a young age is undesirable. I'm not sure who is 'innocent', and I don't think that I should be making that judgement without reliable information about the situation.

[Wicquor]

My views are...

1) What is happening to youth? Well they are just getting bolder and bolder day by day ignoring the consequences and they are very weak minded ( can't control their desires). Well parents are becoming more and more liberal and many schools don't have Personality Development Classes. In a typical local school that I have observes ruffians are respected and they have huge friend circle whereas people who are very good ( having respect for all people and is aware of all the moral values ) are just blacklisted ! Completely opposite to what I read in novels and story books wherein the good people are very popular and the bad people are completely rejected in the society. Also nowadays I think that youth are constantly exposed to bad things and bad companies and that is why most of the youths are today might be intelligent but morally devoid.

2) My tax money to look after them? I would rather be happy if the government put them in jail especially boy. Even the girl must be punished because she was not forced into this and even her mother must go to jail for not inculcating moral values in her. I, as an economic student have some different theory. The government must confiscate all the property of both that boy and girl ( if the girl is raped, the govt must confiscate the property of boy and give it to the girl.). Then you will all see how these sort of stupidity will vanish from this earth.

Firstly, a single example of a girl becoming pregnant is not sufficient enough to support the idea youth are becoming "weak-minded". Not all teenagers become pregnant, and pregnancy and childbirth may be the result of a lack of sexual education or the failure of birth control measures. Birth control can fail for adults as well. Furthermore, how do you decide what moral values are best, and what types of people are "morally devoid"? In the past, 15 year olds did marry and have children as this was socially acceptable. I do not understand what you mean by "Personality Development Classes", but I have never attended a class specifically targeted towards developing my personality. I do not, however, think that I can be classified as a "morally devoid" person.

Secondly, childbirth is not a crime, and sending young children or adolescents to jail for pregnancy is not beneficial to society as it leaves their infant children without a healthy environment in which to grow up in (and children should not be given up for adoption without their parents' consent--see Australia in the 20th century) and is unlikely to cause "stupidity..[to] vanish from this earth".

You argue that the girl in this situation should be sent to jail "because she was not forced". Even if sending teen (or tween) parents to jail was legal, sending people with an exception for rape creates a situation where rape victims can be sent to jail unless they are willing to reveal that they have been raped and can prove that they were raped.

So, do you think having illegitimate child is ethical?

There's actually nothing unethical about it.

It's not criminal, illegal or wrong in any way; it's only hindering her and not affecting anyone outside of her circle.

Also, nobody needs to be blamed in this situation; I don't think you're getting the point. If someone were simply to be blamed in this situation, nothing will be solved and the only thing that will happen is the girl suffering from familial problems and problems at school/with friends. Calling her actions unethical or referring to her as indecent or immoral is just wrong, unwarranted and silly. You don't know her situation, you don't know how she's feeling and therefore you've no right to judge her based on that. Also, you can't "inculcate" moral values in someone; I used to have moral education lessons or w/e when I was in primary school and they've really done no good for me; whether you do the right thing or not is entirely your choice and sure, people can guide you, but nobody can make your choices for you in the end. As I said before, there will always be rebels or curious people.

Plus, are you suggesting that people who haven't taken "personality development classes" are immoral? Can a class really even develop your personality? A few hours in a room can't define your behaviour.

The situation needs to be rectified, with medical intervention, family therapy sessions, counselling and the like instead of shoving money into her hands.

[T-Bear]

This incident with this girl does not say anything about today's youth. There will always be stupid people who don't learn from their errors. In my opinion such cases should be taken seriously but you should not generalize like some people here have done.

I don't think today's youth is more unresponsible than previous generations. Part of the problem is that media only highlights the few negative cases, not the millions who are responsible, getting an education, working and paying taxes later in life.

[Brienna]

My views are...

1) What is happening to youth? Well they are just getting bolder and bolder day by day ignoring the consequences and they are very weak minded ( can't control their desires). Well parents are becoming more and more liberal and many schools don't have Personality Development Classes. In a typical local school that I have observes ruffians are respected and they have huge friend circle whereas people who are very good ( having respect for all people and is aware of all the moral values ) are just blacklisted ! Completely opposite to what I read in novels and story books wherein the good people are very popular and the bad people are completely rejected in the society. Also nowadays I think that youth are constantly exposed to bad things and bad companies and that is why most of the youths are today might be intelligent but morally devoid.

2) My tax money to look after them? I would rather be happy if the government put them in jail especially boy. Even the girl must be punished because she was not forced into this and even her mother must go to jail for not inculcating moral values in her. I, as an economic student have some different theory. The government must confiscate all the property of both that boy and girl ( if the girl is raped, the govt must confiscate the property of boy and give it to the girl.). Then you will all see how these sort of stupidity will vanish from this earth.

WHOAWHOAWHOA let's slow down here. Jail? For having kids? You can't throw people in jail only because their moral code does not "measure up" to yours. Applying a strict moral code on citizens with the threat of jail time can be equated to a theocracy, in my opinion, not a democracy. She's not affecting anyone outside of her social circle. The only reason we're bothering with this post is because of the tax money involved, so don't attack her.

Also, calling every youth weak-minded is a pretty weak-minded thing to say. Youth is as it has always been. Do you not remember the 60s? What about years ago, when women were viewed as baby-making machines? Then. they had children as young as twelve. The only difference is that they were prepared for having kids their whole lives, and not allowed an education because of it. If the mother is provided the proper education (doesn't have to be fancy, just the basics), she can avoid any "morally-devoid" decisions in the future, and better her own life in the process. Shame is not a motivator.

So, do you think having illegitimate child is ethical?

Nobody needs to be blamed in this situation; I don't think you're getting the point. If someone were simply to be blamed in this situation, nothing will be solved and the only thing that will happen is the girl suffering from familial problems and problems at school/with friends. Calling her actions unethical or referring to her as indecent or immoral is just wrong, unwarranted and silly. You don't know her situation, you don't know how she's feeling and therefore you've no right to judge her based on that. Also, you can't "inculcate" moral values in someone; I used to have moral education lessons or w/e when I was in primary school and they've really done no good for me; whether you do the right thing or not is entirely your choice and sure, people can guide you, but nobody can make your choices for you in the end. As I said before, there will always be rebels or curious people.

Plus, are you suggesting that people who haven't taken "personality development classes" are immoral? Can a class really even develop your personality? A few hours in a room can't define your behaviour.

The situation needs to be rectified, with medical intervention, family therapy sessions, counselling and the like instead of shoving money into her hands.

THIS. I totally agree.

On a separate note, I thought it would be worth mentioning that I have never had an actual sex-ed class, and I'm in 12th grade. The only education I've received has been about abstinence (yeah, right) and STDs (and even that wasn't thorough enough to be effective). If the only way we can teach our youth to not have kids is to deny natural urges, we're gonna have a problem. Try teaching them to put on a condom properly, or educate them about birth control. If they want to have sex, and abstinence talk of "Don't have sex because you'll get pregnant and DIE" isn't going to discourage them. Just teach them how to do it safely. And with modern media, the sooner the better.

[poppop828]

1) I personally believe that as time goes on and science advances, atheism is becoming more and more popular among our youth, and more and more of them are losing moral values, many of which were previously grounded in religious belief. Obviously, if the girl was Christian, she wouldn't have had a child (unless she was raped, which, in this case, I'm assuming she wasn't?... I did not read the article), and thus, the problem would never have presented itself in the first place. This may be naive of me, and I would love for someone to refute the following statement, but I believe that the lack of moral values (mostly caused by an absence of religious beliefs) causes many... MANY... of our societal issues that present themselves today. Regardless of whether or not you believe, you have to admit that the guidelines set in place by a religious moral structure would help society more than hurt at this point. Also, I believe that many of today's troubled youth have little hope for the future and live more in the moment simply because they see no point in thinking progressively or hoping for a bright future. Again, tracing this back to lack of religious belief... If these people possessed any sort of religious belief, they would have hope for the future (and potentially an after-life) and thus, regardless of their family's economic situation, they would have hope. This may all be far fetched, but it's what I've come to believe over about the course of the last year, and this is the first time I've actually voiced it. Hopefully someone will challenge it for me.

2) What to do, what to do... Obviously I think that the girl should be punished in some way if she was not raped, but not in a severe way... She cannot just keep living off of gobs of gov't funding because she'll just keep making mistakes and thinking the gov't will jump in whenever she needs help... Which is WRONG, people need to experience consequences for their own stupidity. Obviously, she is very young and not yet an adult, so maybe even take the children away? They also need a fair chance at the game of life, so possibly place them in a better environment where they have, as I said before, a fair chance. The girl, however, needs to now have gov't funding stripped sans the absolutely necessary to live, which really should be provided by her parents seeing as she is not yet 18.

[Absolutely Positively]

1) I personally believe that as time goes on and science advances, atheism is becoming more and more popular among our youth, and more and more of them are losing moral values, many of which were previously grounded in religious belief. Obviously, if the girl was Christian, she wouldn't have had a child (unless she was raped, which, in this case, I'm assuming she wasn't?... I did not read the article), and thus, the problem would never have presented itself in the first place. This may be naive of me, and I would love for someone to refute the following statement, but I believe that the lack of moral values (mostly caused by an absence of religious beliefs) causes many... MANY... of our societal issues that present themselves today. Regardless of whether or not you believe, you have to admit that the guidelines set in place by a religious moral structure would help society more than hurt at this point. Also, I believe that many of today's troubled youth have little hope for the future and live more in the moment simply because they see no point in thinking progressively or hoping for a bright future. Again, tracing this back to lack of religious belief... If these people possessed any sort of religious belief, they would have hope for the future (and potentially an after-life) and thus, regardless of their family's economic situation, they would have hope. This may all be far fetched, but it's what I've come to believe over about the course of the last year, and this is the first time I've actually voiced it. Hopefully someone will challenge it for me.

2) What to do, what to do... Obviously I think that the girl should be punished in some way if she was not raped, but not in a severe way... She cannot just keep living off of gobs of gov't funding because she'll just keep making mistakes and thinking the gov't will jump in whenever she needs help... Which is WRONG, people need to experience consequences for their own stupidity. Obviously, she is very young and not yet an adult, so maybe even take the children away? They also need a fair chance at the game of life, so possibly place them in a better environment where they have, as I said before, a fair chance. The girl, however, needs to now have gov't funding stripped sans the absolutely necessary to live, which really should be provided by her parents seeing as she is not yet 18.

O‘kay. So. I‘m assuming you‘re christian and believe in ‘no sex before marriage‘, correct me if I‘m wrong.

You‘re setting religious belief equal to christianity, which I think is a mistake. There are so many different religions and every religion has their own ,rules‘ you can‘t just put them in one pot. Also, atheism can be seen as a belief.

In my opinion, this girl having children has nothing to do with christianity, but with stupidity. According to you this would not have happened because she would have to get married first, which you cannot do if you‘re underaged. I agree to some point. - But, if we‘re spinning this a little further, the girl would have married and would have had many children then because according to the bible and the pope and what not protection (like condoms) is not allowed. So, she‘d end up getting government taxes anyway - unless she‘d marry some rich guy. (Considering that 50% of all marriages are divorced nowadays)

I also believe that not having sex before marriage and being a virgin has nothing to do with not wanting it, but with having the respect of ones family and environment. At least in some cultures it can destroy a whole family.

I know a girl who‘s parents are muslim. (She‘s atheist...) So, she was expected to stay a virgin, but she had a boyfriend and you know the rest... Anyway. She didn‘t regret having sex (with protection and all) but she still had a guilty conscience because of her parents and what her whole family would think of her. That just can‘t be it.

,Regardless of their family‘s economic situation, they would have hope‘. Yeah. O‘kay. But if you‘re poor and believe in god, you also give the little bit of money you have to the church because you have hope, ergo you stay poor.

I believe that it has got more to do with the lack of education (school and parents). Yes, she probably didn‘t think of the consequences. But parents are responsible for their children, so it‘s not just on her. As a parent you should make sure to educate your child and supply it with the pill, if necessary. At least, that‘s what I would do. Again, that has nothing to do with whether I‘m pleased or not with the fact that my child has a boyfriend (I would not be), but at least I could make sure that I don‘t become a grandparent at the age of 40. - I guess most parents are busy working and think that the school will take care of it. Children come with responsibility, they just don‘t want to see that.

Hoping for a bright future correlates with christianity? Where did you get that from? Evidence? Maybe they use the time they would spend with their boyfriends to study, so they get good grades. No, seriously. At the age of 14 you dream about your future, but you don‘t plan it. You enjoy life while you can. That‘s what you‘re supposed to do as a child. (And that‘s perfectly possible while getting good grades.)

I agree that it has to do with morals. But there‘s nothing wrong with atheism. There are kids who believe in god that party hard and stay up all night whereas there are kids who don‘t believe in anything and stay home and study. Really, you can‘t say everything‘s better with Jesus. Whether a kid has morals depends on its parents and its education and the environment it grows up in.